another gameplay question

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or2az
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Re: another gameplay question

Post by or2az » Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:46 am

I like your choice of a 6-dot better than the 9-bam but I decided to go with the 2-dot .
Wanted to keep all options open, including toi-toi.
I do see that East might be collecting dots but like you said, it's early, and I did have an 8000pt lead.

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by or2az » Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:08 am

Need to refresh my memory on the following situation.
One of the ladies in my group called RIICHI and had 4-dot 5-dot 6-dot 7-dot 8-dot in her hand, needing a
3-dot 6-dot 9-dot for the win.
She had a temporary brain freeze and overlooked a 6-dot for the win when discarded by her opposite player.
She unfroze when the next player discarded another 6-dot which she believed was her winner.
I negated that, saying that DURING RIICHI, YOU CAN NOT CLAIM A WIN ON A TILE THAT YOU PASSED UP FOR A WIN IN THE SAME TURN.
Two turns later, she called RON on a discarded 3-dot .
I stated this WAS VALID.
Am I correct in all of this?

Also, would the second 6-dot have been a good RON if there was no Riichi?

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by Shirluban » Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:21 am

Once someone declares riichi and let pass a winning tile, they can no longer claim any tile for a win (i.e. until the hand is over).
When not in riichi, they can't ron on the same turn they let pass a winning tile (i.e. until their next draw).
This applies also to "winning" tiles not giving any yaku. And the restriction is on any tile, not only the missed one.
In any case, the player can still win by self-draw.

So she couldn't ron the 6-dot , and neither the 3-dot two turns later.
Without riichi, the second 6-dot would still have been a no-go; however, the 3-dot (or another 6-dot or 9-dot ) two turns later would be fine.
Cats don't do タンヤオ (tan-yao) but タニャーオ (ta-nya-o).
World Riichi Championship Rules
Comparison of riichi rules around the world

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by Referee » Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:25 pm

Shirluban is correct. Remember this: There are not furiten tiles, there are furiten hands. If you are furiten on one of your "waits", you are furiten on all of them.

And I put quotation marks around "waits" because a no-yaku wait still counts as a wait. If you don't claim a wait, you are furiten until your next draw (this can take several go-arounds if there are calls skipping your turn). If you don't claim a wait during riichi, you are furiten for the rest of the hand.

Furiten applies only to claims. If you draw your winning tile, it's a valid tsumo even if you are furiten.

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by or2az » Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:49 pm

Understood. Furiten vs temporary furiten.
I assume this is also meant to prevent one from targeting a certain player in riichi and making you wait a turn for targeting a certain player when not in riichi.
Now comes the fun part of explaining it to the ladies.
Thanks guys.

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by or2az » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:53 am

After reading your replies again, and more research, I need a bit more clarification regarding " FURITEN with no-yaku waits, before I attempt to explain this part of it.
1) 1-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-crak 5-crak 6-crak 6-bam 7-bam 8-bam red-dra red-dra 5-dot 5-dot
If my opposite player discards a 5-dot , which I can't claim for a win (no yaku), and the next discard is a red-dra , I can not RON due to temporary FURITEN.
Is this correct?

2) 1-dot 2-dot 3-dot 4-crak 5-crak 6-crak 6-bam 7-bam 5-dot 5-dot 5-dot 9-dot 9-dot
If my opposite player discards a 5-bam , which I can't claim for a win (no yaku), and the next player upgrades his open 8-bam 8-bam 8-bam to a kong, I can not RON (chankan, robbing a kong) due to temporary furiten.
Is this correct?
I did not realize that both of these situations are considered passing up a win since, in actuality, I could not win with the tile I passed up.
(I also can't ever recall these occurring in the video games and being prevented from winning)
Help!
Last edited by or2az on Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by Referee » Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:56 am

Both cases correct.

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Re: another gameplay question

Post by or2az » Fri Mar 06, 2020 3:27 pm

Very interesting.
I suppose this NO YAKU-PASSING UP A WAIT-TEMPORARY FURITEN situation is not a common occurrence but now that my groups are starting to go for tenpai late in a hand when a draw seems imminent, it could happen.
Explaining that you are not actually passing up a wait for a WIN that puts you in FURITEN, but in reality, are passing up a wait for a COMPLETE HAND, will test me, but they will see the difference.
I found this in Barts Guide. It will help.
received_3667875846587789.jpeg
received_3667875846587789.jpeg (17.6 KiB) Viewed 457 times
Thanks again for all the help.

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