Furiten question

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Nisse
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Re:Furiten ramblings.

Post by Nisse » Sat Jan 02, 2010 3:25 am

You need to work on your attitude. I simply answered the questions given in this thread.

I don\'t claim to know everything about riichi mahjong, but I do know some - even though I\'m not a regular on this forum.

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Re:Furiten question

Post by deJENNerate » Mon Jan 04, 2010 6:10 am

If you\'ve declared Reach, and you pass up your winning tile, then you are furiten indefinitely.

If you have not declared Reach, then you must have a turn yourself before you can win on a discard again. If another player pons, skipping your turn, then you are still furiten. If another player chows, then your turn would not be skipped, it just wouldn\'t be your turn yet, so you are absolutely, 100% still furiten.

As far as I know, as long as you are the one that pons or chows and you discard a tile, then it counts as you having a turn and you won\'t be furiten anymore, but I will double-check that today. Generally a call like that would change your wait anyway, so it would be an extremely rare occurrence, but it could happen with a quad as well. The quad would give you the draw from the King\'s tiles (wanpai) so I do believe that would count as your turn. Like I said, I\'ll double-check it today.

I actually didn\'t realize that the rule in EMA is different than here. I never played anywhere that allowed furiten to end with a call from another player, especially with a chow, since with a chow it would be the same go-around and no players are skipped over. I must not have noticed that part when we were developing the EMA rule set (or I forgot, which is very likely), but that\'s a very important thing to know with all of the Riichi tournaments coming up this year (especially since I\'m planning to come play with you guys! yay!)

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Re:Furiten question

Post by drob » Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:37 pm

yay~

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Re:Furiten question

Post by Ignatius » Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:30 pm

What happens when you call Riichi, discard a tile and, in that moment, you enter in Furiten?
If you´re in Temporary Furiten you cannot win that turn with any of your winning tiles by Ron?

The temporary Furiten affects you if one of discarded tiles give you no Yaku? (I think not, because it does´nt make sense, but I don´t know)
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Re:Furiten question

Post by Referee » Fri Apr 30, 2010 12:51 pm

Do you mean you enter furiten by your riichi discard, or by missing a tile?

If you hand can be complete (complete doesn\'t mean valid, a no-yaku 3+3+3+3+2 is complete) by:
a) Any of your discarded tiles
b) Any tile discarded after you Reached
c) Any tile discarded after the last Chi/Pon/Kan call or your last discard (whichever came later)

then you are Furiten, and you can\'t Ron with ANY tile.

I\'ve been hit by it, still have to learn to avoid it. I discard the 9 early, and end up waiting with 87.

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Re:Furiten question

Post by Ignatius » Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:14 pm

I was talking about entering in furiten by my riichi discard.
If you´re in furiten with one of your winning tiles, and then you declare Riichi, can you win with Ron with the tiles you´re not in furiten?
I think you can.
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Re:Furiten question

Post by Ruro » Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:27 pm

unfortunately nope. If you can complete your hand with ANY of your discards then you are furiten for ALL of your waits... Also if you get furiten by your riichi discard its still counts as being furiten, so you can only win by drawing your winning tile.

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Re:Furiten question

Post by Referee » Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:41 pm

You might be thinking of the house rule where you declare Furiten Riichi, but that one\'s highly non-standard.

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Re:Furiten question

Post by Ignatius » Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:41 pm

Thank you very much!
Life is as beautiful as you want it to be, but it´s only one. That´s why you must not get tired of it. Don´t care if you don´t say something that seems "important" because your mere existence is important for someone.

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Re: Furiten question

Post by or2az » Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:16 pm

After reading all of the above from 4 years ago, I think I have my answer but I'm not sure I understand why.
Situation is as follows:
I have an open tenpai hand going for tanyao. My wait is 1-dot 4-dot .
Obviously, the 1-dot will not give me the win, so I am really just waiting for the 4-dot.
When it was discarded, I could not claim it, and got a furiten message. (temporary, I think)
I think this was because I just passed up the 1-dot during that turn.
I passed up a tile that would have COMPLETED MY HAND but not a tile that would have GIVEN ME THE WIN.
I thought that TEMPORARY furiten was when you passed up an opportunity to take a RON WIN. (Barticles guide, p43)
I must be missing something here.
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Re: Furiten question

Post by Shirluban » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:32 pm

I thought that TEMPORARY furiten was when you passed up an opportunity to take a RON WIN.
Furiten (temporary or not) is for missing an opportunity to complete the hand. Not necessary to win.
Even letting pass a non-winnable hand will get you furiten.

So you're right: Letting pass the 1-dot made you temporary furiten, despite you could not call it.
Cats don't do タンヤオ (tan-yao) but タニャーオ (ta-nya-o).
World Riichi Championship Rules
Comparison of riichi rules around the world

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Re: Furiten question

Post by Kyuu » Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:23 pm

Furiten asks you the question:

"What are you tenpai for?"

In actuality, you can call ron for that 1-pin; but you get chombo for not having yaku.
when you passed up an opportunity to take a RON WIN. (Barticles guide, p43)
He needs to fix that.

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Re: Furiten question

Post by Barticle » Mon Mar 03, 2014 6:57 pm

Noted, thanks guys.

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Re: Furiten question

Post by Referee » Wed Mar 05, 2014 12:59 am

What I noticed is that my explanation of four years ago is wrong, since the last Pon/Chi/Kan doesn't have anything to do with it.

On or2az's question, as it has been told, that's correct. That ippin made you furiten until your next turn, which hasn't come yet.

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Re: Furiten question

Post by Senechal » Sat Mar 08, 2014 8:35 pm

What a trip down memory lane, with such quality posting like telling me to improve my attitude.

Four years later:

a) I'm still not wrong.
b) Furiten isn't ippatsu, nor do they share the same mechanics.
c) Europe is gradually changing to adapt to the world (WRC2014 rules) as opposed to trying to bend the world to its will (EMA2008/2012 rules).

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